home *** CD-ROM | disk | FTP | other *** search
- Path: gryphon.phoenix.net!usenet
- From: "David F. St.Clair" <dstclair@i-o.com>
- Newsgroups: comp.object,comp.software-eng,comp.lang.c++
- Subject: Re: Moving from C to C++
- Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 10:04:42 -0600
- Organization: Input/Output
- Message-ID: <30F5351A.3150@i-o.com>
- References: <4cs44p$3pk@ixnews8.ix.netcom.com> <30F2A73C.7519@i-o.com> <1996Jan10.024013.8711@ohstpy>
- NNTP-Posting-Host: 205.241.79.33
- Mime-Version: 1.0
- Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
- Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
- X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0b4 (X11; I; SunOS 5.4 sun4m)
- CC: dfs
-
- > In article <30F2A73C.7519@i-o.com>, "David F. St.Clair" <dstclair@i-o.com> writes:
- > > Rocco Pochy wrote:
- > >> anybody have any experiences in moving from a structure C environment
- > >> to that of an object-oriented C++ environment?
-
- I wrote:
- > >
- > > Start using C++ as a better C. Get your group accustomed to the language and
- > > the new tools. Stay away from most things that are OO.
- > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
- > vancleef@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu wrote:
- >
- > Nonsense. The reason FOR using C++ is for OO.
- >
- I disagree. OO is A reason for using C++, not THE reason. C++ used as a 'better C'
- provides many tangible benefits. Remember the original design goals of C++ were:
-
- - be a better C
- - support data abstraction
- - support OOP
- > I wrote:
- > > After around 3-6 months, get some formal OO training. Suitcase the course in
- > > as well. There are several good 5 day courses out there. Include managers in the
- > > training classes. Make a big production of training and stress the importance.
-
- > vancleef@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu wrote:
- > Treating OO like it's the 'chapter at the end of the book' is a waste of
- > their time. You must teach OO from the beginning.
- >
- > C++ is a better C only to C programmers who refuse to change from
- > structures programming. If you C++ programmers, you are going to have to
- > teach OO from the first day. Anythig else is a waste of time.
- In an ideal world, I would have engineers trained in both the methodology and language
- at once. But it just doesn't work that way for all people. I have several gifted
- developers who I can rely on to master about anything I throw their way -- but I have
- others who do not learn quite as fast. If I'm to move an entire department (or company)
- in a certain direction, I have to map out a plan to get EVERYONE to the promised land.
-
- In learning any new skill, the skill must be used soon after learning or much of the
- practical application will be lost. This directly applies in the above case: learning
- fundamental OO techniques without mastery of a language that allows for easy expression
- would be wasting the initial OO training.
-
- I might be over generalizing here, but the companies I've worked for have a desire
- to make money. Time to market is crucial. By employing a tiered approach to get
- to C++ and OOP, you should be able to satisfy time-to-market constraints while learning
- new skills that will enable you to improve current/future projects (including reducing
- time-to-market).
-
- > vancleef@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu wrote:
- >
- > I programmed in C for years. It took me *one week* to learn C++ when thrown
- > into 50,000 lines of badly written C++ (written by C programmers who
- > tried to use some OO concepts) and asked to 'make it work'. I
- > did. I will never look back.
- Good for you. As I said, there are some people who can learn C++/OOP simulatenously
- and run with it. But not everyone -- like the programmers who wrote the 50K lines
- of 'badly written C++'. Perhaps if they would have been eased into C++/OOP you
- wouldn't have needed to rewrite their code.
-
- > Me:
- > > Look for evolutionary changes/benefits, not revolutionary.
- > >
- > vancleef@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu wrote:
- > Sorry, but C++ is revolutionary. C++ is NOT a better C and teaching this
- > to people on your payroll is a waste of money.
- I think Stroustrup might disagree :-)
- (Check out the first chapter of 'The C++ Programming Language')
-
- Anyway I was not talking about the language, I was talking about the benefits
- that you can expect from using C++/OOP.
-
- --
- Dave St.Clair dstclair@i-o.com
- Project Manager Input/Output
-